Marg are you talking about the householders insurance ?
I would take the issue to the oumbudsman if they don't come to the party
PS sorry to hear of the problem you have. But I would get an engineer to give you advice.
All insurance companies will try everything to put the blame elsewhere.
What insurance company is this ?
Post the details on hellopeter as well
Hi Neil and Marge so sorry to hear about such bad luck.
Who is you insurer? Water CAN AND WILL lift tiles. I am with ABSA for my structural and Auto & Gen for household and vehicles, never experienced such rotten issues with any of these two.
Thats a lot of damage.
What is important is to get an independant Civil Engineer from a reputable firm to advise you and who will be willing to take the matter to court on your behalf. I have a feeling this is where this will end up.
Strongs Neill and Marge.
Sorry to hear this.
Obviously the damage needs attention.
You need to determine the exact cause of the damage, which may or may not be water. If you lived in Carletonville, you would understand what I am trying to say. Then you must see if that type of damage is covered in the insurance.
Unfortunately, the onus is on you to prove the cause. If you are covered, you may be able to recover your costs.
Sorry to say, you will probably need legal advice n addition to the engineer
Very sorry to hear your problem but I am not sure I understand correctly.
Is this hole (presumably not coverd by concrete) in the foundation or is it in the floor itself ?
The floor concrete is usually 75 mm thick and repairing/filling the hole is not a problem.
Even if you have cracks in the floor concrete these can be simply repaired but if they are big cracks (more than 2 -3 mm wide and going right throgh the concrete)then something drastic has to be done. I they are small and only on the surface (which I suspect) or thereabouts, fill them and carry on living.....
Also,. it depends on the age of your place. .
Please note that cracks are occuring in floors and walls all the times., some you see and some you don't see.
To me it will appear that from your description, the floor was not cast completely and a hole was left and covered by tiles (I am not quite sure how this could have happened).
It is also not clear where the water was/is coming from (is it ground water which rose up throughthe hole in the floor concrete?)
Without looking at this floor , it is impossible to form a valid opinion and therefore I would propose that you contact the MASTER BUILDERS ASSOCIAION and ask them for an opinion, they also send out engineers, if neccessary.
That is a cost you cannot get around unless you have a friend or aquaintance who could advise you further.
Insurances will generally NOT PAY if the damage is/was caused by rising ground water or by subsistance, they will pay when the damage occurs throug burst pipes, rain storms , flooding, etc., even accidental damage.
MArg, so sorry to read from your problems. You had some sound advice - ombudsman, second opinion from structural engineer, stay on their case, give them hell. Best of luck.
With all due respect Japie, this is after all the general chat section where we advice and seek advice.
Neill & MArg. You have not upset anyone except Japie. I believe the majority of Forum readers would like to help with advice if we knew what to say wrt your problem.
I also believe that it if one has a problem with the topic, then give it a pass. In my short experience on this website and its Forums ( or is a Fora - wat sê die Engelse vriende?) I have seen a variety of requests for advice and/or assistance. In your case, you have turned to what I see as a body of friends that may have had experience in solving your type of problem or who can give advice of where to turn to.
We live in a dolomite area. Every time it rains and we watch the water damming up, we hope that it does not drain into a sinkhole. Hoping your problem is less serious than what it sounds like.
Agree with Butts - here we become one BIG family!
MArg, give no attention to that remark. If we cannot ask our best "friends and family" for advice here, I would rather not be part of the forum at all.
The ombudsman is like a person.organization looking after the interests of the man on the street, whether you have problem with insurance claim, medical, car dealer or whatever.
In your policy document (home owners insurance), normally close to the back on the contract, the telephone number of the Ombudsman for Short Term Insurance MUST be displayed.
If you cannot find it, gooi me an e-mail to email@example.com, I will mail it to you. You still might have my e-mail address on you computer??
Japie has been a member for 3 years, and the 1st anyone hears from him is to slap someone down???
Japie, perhaps you could point out a community based forum specialising in civil engineering and/or insurance claims, that deals with issues in laymans terms??? Did'nt think so.
Sorry Marg, I have no relevant info to add, but I hope you come right. That hole sounds like a headache no-one needs!
Hi Neill and MArg,
I hope it goes well for you. This forum is like facebook, but for the mature peaple. Keep on as we are. Err does rugby have anything to do with camping.
Neil and Marg, your photos about your hobbies came on very nicely, that worked fine, have you changed your browser / hardware since then? My reason for asking is i also battle to upload photos, some will actually popup twice in the same reply (look under " hulp met alarm").
Another reason i am interested to follow your topuc is: In the mid 1980s i lived at Taaibos and the house we had was build on concrete pylons. If you sat down at one end of the house, you could actually see the otherside of the house. I remember nailing some "ogies draad" to the wall and ground as my daughter at the time was just over a year old and we we worried that she could fall into that empty cavity below the house.
From what i gather here your problem is very differend from what we had some years ago when my shower leaked, and the tiles came off as a result. ABSA insurance covered our damage."as a result" but the plumbing i had to cover.
OK people, let's leave it at that, and let the person be, as well as his remarks. It is the general feeling here that it was not appropriate, and it was so expressed, but PLEASE, let's not go scalp-hunting any further.
Said person can apologise, or not, but in keeping on with it is not going to bring MArg closer to any solution!!!!
Sorry for this post, but I really feel that we are not going to gain anything by this.
Ek hebt gesegt!!!! what I feel!!!!
Glad to hear you getting somewhere. But where is the water coming from? You mentioned swimming pool earlier on. Gosh hope its not from the pool!
Thanks for the update Marg keep us posted
Hi Guys. A bit of a long winded response but it may help:
1. A "void" in soil is invariably caused by a water leak which slowly leeches out the silty soil (fines). All "sink holes" are caused this way. To avoid this, periodically switch off all taps around the house and make sure that the water meter is not registering any flow.
Once the water ingress has been stopped, you will have to determine the stability of the soil and a soilcrete or high slump concrete can be used to fill the void. You MUST get approval from the insurance company for the repair before it is done as if there is a problem later, they will reject your claim.
2.The short term insurance ombudsman contact is ValerieMngadi on firstname.lastname@example.org. Unfortunately, she only acts as a mediator between the insurance and the complaintant and does not get involved in resolving a technical matter. For this you would have to take legal council.
3.It is reasonable that you may be able to claim on the basis that the leak was undetectable owing to being under concrete - make sure that you can prove that your water usage per month over the past couple of years has been constant and not risen in the past short term.
4.The moment that you accept any payment from any insurance company you are deemed to have accepted their ruling and no further payment for this issue will ever be entertained. Be careful that they do not merely pay the amount the feel directly into your account.
5.It has been my experience that insurance companies currently automatically reject your claim but with threats and perserverence, you may occassionally get a fair compensation.
Good luck Neil and Marg. Hopefully they will see their error in judgment.
Hi Neil and Marge. Hope its going better at this time or are you still having a junior war with the insurance?
MArg, please, do give us an update on all the "happenings" !!!! concerning the outcome of engineer's report, insurance's response, the whole story, and if you can "colour" it with photos, even better!!!
Thanks for keeping us updated Marg, realy hoping you come right with the insurance.
Pitty you cant get pictures posted I am very keen to see not only the final product, but slso Neil's bar, the last we saw was with the supports still on it.
MArg, thanks for sharing. I understand about photos, and also with insurance sh*t still to be sorted out, Stand strong, and do remember he Ombudsman should you have trouble from insurance, Keep all invoices, receipts and reports in safe place!!!!\
Do go and enjoy the Pennington camp, you all need it!!!!
All i can say is "sterkte".
Marg thanks for the photos. From the one photo looks like you could have made a wine cellar down there
Did you find the source of the water?
MArg, thanks for showing us/sharing, all I can say, is - sterkte!!!!
Brian, before MArg and Neill bought the place, it must have belonged to Osama Bin Laden!!!!! was his SA hidaway!!!
Neill and Marg, it looks like it never going to end, every day something new. Yes, and now to get the smell out of the freezer. Put peases of coal in the freezer. It worked for us. At this stage it is not your biggest worry. Good luck
MArg, wash fridge with strong mixture of Milton, then wash it with strong mixture of vanilla essence, should do the trick, You can also leave a container with vanilla essence 50% mix with water in the fridge for day or so. I think best thing will be to leave the fridge door open as well
The pieces of coal that Kurt is mentioning, is actually coal or anthracite? spelling, you can try charcoal or briquettes as well.
Many, many years ago my mom used to put a piece of coal in the fridge permanently.
Hallo Marg. We have not tried charcoal or brickets. After 20years we stil keep a piece in the fridge. It realy helps to keep the smells away. We also did what Frans said, by washing with vanilla essance. The thing is, that the smell does not go away overnight.
Wow the pics look hectic, thanks for the update. Realy hope all gets sorted soon .
Neil and Marge, how are things progressing there? being thinking of you guys all day. Hope to hear some good news